I need a diagram to help explain F-stops

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5G IF-ED

10/08/2009 09:58:40 PM · #1

I need a diagram to help explain F-stops for a nature photography presentation to a small group. Does anyone have one laying around?

johst582

Nikon D80

10/08/2009 11:19:52 PM · #2

Not a diagram, but you might find it useful: //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Jonquil_flowers_merged.jpg

paynekj

Pentax K10D

Pentax DA 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 AF

10/09/2009 12:03:46 AM · #3

Let Me Google That For You

CEJ

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF-S 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

10/09/2009 02:23:12 AM · #4

Look at this page or a better one here.

Message edited by author 2009-10-09 06:26:31.

dleach

Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM

10/09/2009 08:18:12 AM · #5

Originally posted by paynekj:

Let Me Google That For You

Too funny...

10/09/2009 08:37:14 AM · #6

Originally posted by paynekj:

Let Me Google That For You

Thanks for nothing. Rude I spent no less than an hour looking for one with google. I understand fstops. Thats not what I'm looking for at all. Go make your own topic if you want to try to be funny. You are trying to say it was that easy to find, but you didn't find one at all.

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM

10/09/2009 08:38:21 AM · #7

Originally posted by CEJ:

Look at this page or a better one here.

Thanks, I had seen the first one but not the second, I like it and will ask permission to use.

bobonacus

Canon EOS-7D

10/09/2009 08:40:11 AM · #8

//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-number

Message edited by author 2009-10-09 12:40:23.

cpanaioti

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

10/09/2009 09:26:19 AM · #9

Thanks for the wiki link. That's a good explanation as well.

hankk

Canon EOS-5D

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 EX Aspherical DF for Canon

10/09/2009 11:53:56 AM · #10

Originally posted by Niten:

Originally posted by paynekj:
Let Me Google That For You

Thanks for nothing. Rude I spent no less than an hour looking for one with google. I understand fstops. Thats not what I'm looking for at all. Go make your own topic if you want to try to be funny. You are trying to say it was that easy to find, but you didn't find one at all.

It would help if you would explain exactly what you want the diagram to show. If google as paynekj suggested, then click the "images" link on the Google SERP, you get this page //images.google.com/images?pws=0&q=f-stops%20explained&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi which has several diagrams.

The page //www.imatest.com/docs/print_tour_q13.html has a section "Why measure noise in f-stops?" that is interesting.

Message edited by author 2009-10-09 15:55:50.

Bebe

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

10/09/2009 12:07:49 PM · #11

Originally posted by paynekj:

Let Me Google That For You

That is really funny.

Photologist

Apple iPhone 14 Pro Max

10/09/2009 12:10:04 PM · #12

A diagram? How about the one on this page? (scroll down some)

aplomb76

Canon EOS-1D Mark IIn

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

10/09/2009 05:01:56 PM · #13

Originally posted by CEJ:

Look at this page or a better one here.

I really like the animation your 2nd link led to...

Photologist

Apple iPhone 14 Pro Max

10/09/2009 09:34:07 PM · #14

Originally posted by aplomb76:

Originally posted by CEJ:
Look at this page or a better one here.

I really like the animation your 2nd link led to...

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but in that animation, it appears that each aperture setting is twice as big (or half as small) as the one next to it. However, it is misleading.

For example, it appears that the opening at f/8 is twice as big as it is at f/4. I believe that having twice the opening (twice the light) is from f/4 to f/5.6 (1 stop difference). In other words, 1-stop equals twice the light. In the example (after f/4), they are jumping more than 1 stop, but the graphic appears to show the opening to be doubling in size.

The increasing stops (twice the light as the previous) have increments from:

f/2.8 to f/4
f/4 to f/5.6
f/5.6 to f/8
f/8 to f/11
f/11 to f/16
f/16 to f/22

These are considered "whole" stops. Back in the day, this is all we had. Today, any f values between any two whole values are usually third- or half-stops.

Message edited by author 2009-10-10 02:58:32.

MelonMusketeer

Nikon D7000

Nikon MF 50mm f/1.4

10/09/2009 10:44:26 PM · #15

Originally posted by AperturePriority:

Originally posted by aplomb76:

Originally posted by CEJ:
Look at this page or a better one here.

I really like the animation your 2nd link led to...

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but in that animation, it appears that each aperture setting is twice as big (or half as small) as the one next to it. However, it is misleading.

For example, it appears that the opening at f/8 is twice as big as it is at f/4. I believe that having twice the opening (twice the light) is from f/4 to f/5.6 (1 stop difference). In other words, 1-stop equals twice the light. In the example (after f/4), they are jumping more than 1 stop, but the graphic appears to show the opening to be doubling in size.

The increasing stops (twice the light as the previous) have increments from:

f/2.8 to f/4
f/4 to f/5.6
f/5.6 to f/8
f/8 to f/11
f/11 to f/16
f/16 to f/22

These are considered "whole" stops. Back in the day, this is all we had. Today, any f values between any two whole values are usually third- or half-steps.

I agree. If you double the diameter of a circle, the area of the circle is 4 times as large. f numbers are a sort of log scale, where each step smaller aperture, as you have listed, is admitting half as much light. That means to go from f2.8 to f4 and have the same exposure, the time the shutter is open has to be doubled to get the same exposure value at the sensor.

robshookphoto

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 28mm f/1.8 USM

10/09/2009 10:45:28 PM · #16

Originally posted by AperturePriority:

The increasing stops (twice the light as the previous) have increments from:

f/2.8 to f/4
f/4 to f/5.6
f/5.6 to f/8
f/8 to f/11
f/11 to f/16
f/16 to f/22

These are considered "whole" stops. Back in the day, this is all we had. Today, any f values between any two whole values are usually third- or half-steps.

correct

i think the most important thing is to have a chart with the full f-stops.

you can "understand" f-stops without really knowing them and get by with general photography, but as soon as you do ANYTHING more technical you will be lost.

i.e. getting the backlight and mainlight balanced correctly the first time in the studio is impossible without being able to count up and down by full f-stops and knowing how to change strobe output by full stops

in the film world this was basic knowledge, but now with instant gratification it has been lost, even in technical photo school.

Message edited by author 2009-10-10 02:46:53.

NikonJeb

Nikon D850

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 28-300mm f3.5-5.6G ED VR

10/10/2009 06:05:10 AM · #17

Originally posted by paynekj:

Let Me Google That For You

Originally posted by Niten:

I found all sorts of charts through those links.

If you want others to do your homework, actually look at it, and do a little rather than just bitch if you don't get exactly what you think you want.

It *WAS* funny, lighten up.

ETA: BTW,

paynekj, thanks for the links!

Message edited by author 2009-10-10 10:06:14.

Bear_Music

Samsung Galaxy S21, S21+, S21 Ultra

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

10/10/2009 06:19:40 AM · #18

For the record, the "number" is 1.4; multiply each stop by 1.4 to get the next stop. F/2 x 1.4 = f/2.8 x 1.4 = f/4 (actually f/3.92) x 1.4 = f/5.6, and so forth.

Reason: increase diameter of aperture by a factor of 1.4 and double the amount of light passing through in a given length of time.

R.

Shutter-For-Hire

Nikon D90

Nikon AF Nikkor 24mm f/2.8D

10/10/2009 06:29:01 AM · #19

oh... and just incase it hasn't been brought up yet... (correct me if I am wrong) but those f-stop numbers refer to how many of the diameters of the openings you can get in the length of the lens barrel... i.e. if you take the apperture opening on a lens, measure the diameter, i.e. on a 50mm f/1.4 lens, open it reight up to 1.4, and measure the diameter of the opening of the apperture blades, and then measure the length of teh lens barrel, the barrel length will be 1.4 times the apperture opening diameter measurement...

For example, my 10.5mm f/2.8 fisheye lens has a small rear element/apperture opening, even when at f/2.8 because the lens is so short, But, a 180mm f/2.8 lens has a MASSIVE rear element and apperture opening is huge at f/2.8...

did I explain that correctly? =P

Message edited by author 2009-10-10 10:30:01.

kirbic

Canon EOS R5

Canon RF 24-70 f2.8 L IS

10/10/2009 09:50:13 AM · #20

Originally posted by Shutter-For-Hire:

Assuming a simple lens (1 element) then the length of the lens barrel (actually the distance from the front of the barrel to the sensor plane) really is the focal length, and under that special condition this is true. In most real optical systems, it is not.
When we speak about the aperture size, we are really talking about the effective aperture, defined as the apparent size of the light-gathering "window." For instance, on a 200mm f/2.8 lens, it is 200/2.8 or 71.4mm. This doesn't necessarily imply that the physical opening through the diaphragm is 71mm, since the diaphragm is within the optical system, and the ray bundle is smaller there than when it enters (converging front element).
For long focal length lenses, the minimum diameter of the front element determines the f-ratio, and is given by the above calculation. For short focal lengths, the relationship is much more complex.

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II

10/10/2009 04:31:20 PM · #21

Originally posted by NikonJeb:

Originally posted by paynekj:
Let Me Google That For You

Originally posted by Niten:
Thanks for nothing. Rude I spent no less than an hour looking for one with google. I understand fstops. Thats not what I'm looking for at all. Go make your own topic if you want to try to be funny. You are trying to say it was that easy to find, but you didn't find one at all.

I found all sorts of charts through those links.

If you want others to do your homework, actually look at it, and do a little rather than just bitch if you don't get exactly what you think you want.

It *WAS* funny, lighten up.

ETA: BTW, paynekj, thanks for the links!

I appoligize for putting you out so much. I had done my homework and didn't find exactly what I wanted. I believe I have a right to try to find exactly what I want and not have to settle. No where in there did I bitch about it. People post request for stock photos here without harassment, it is photo related, I thought someone might have a stock graphic I could buy. I need permission to use, so far noone has responded to my requests. So I am still doing my homework.

MattO

Nikon D4

10/10/2009 04:42:19 PM · #22

Originally posted by NikonJeb:

Jeb I don't think it was funny either. A member pulled that crap to me when I asked a question and in my opinion its done in poor taste and is rude. If you can't help don't be a smart ass. Of course that is just my opinion.

Matt

NikonJeb

Nikon D850

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 28-300mm f3.5-5.6G ED VR

10/10/2009 07:41:36 PM · #23

Originally posted by MattO:

Well, I'll tell ya what.....here's what he said....

Originally posted by Niten:

I need a diagram to help explain F-stops for a nature photography presentation to a small group. Does anyone have one laying around?

He didn't state that he'd searched around, had no luck, and was frustrated and looking specifically for a chart.

So someone cracks wise, yet *STILL* does offer up some help, and he gets snippy.

I don't have much sympathy, ESPECIALLY when he got downright snotty about it.

Where's the motivation to want to help someone who's gonna jump on you if you don't meet his expectations when he wasn't specific about them?

If you look through the links, which I did, you'll find loads of info AND a couple of different TEACHING AIDS in the form of DIAGRAMS that help to explain F-Stops.

Not that anyone'd give a sh*t, but I know I'll certainly be sure not to offend the OP in the future by offering any help in the future should I have info that might meet his query.

Happy?

NikonJeb

Nikon D850

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 28-300mm f3.5-5.6G ED VR

10/10/2009 07:46:22 PM · #24

Originally posted by Niten:

Sure was nice of you to mention that you were already frustrated and that you were pretty much at the end of your rope.....that would have been nice.

Personally, I don't much care if you give attitude to me; I think you're being a complete dick about it and why anyone would want to help you with your attitude is completely beyond me.

Lotsa luck.

Little tip: DON'T abuse people and expect them to help.

Did you even look at any of the links?