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09/28/2004 07:14:48 PM · #1 |
I will try to keep this short but would like to have some advice. With Very limited funds for a camera my wife purchased me a Panasonic FZ1 12X Zoom from a very well know camera store [nation wide chain]. I was pleased with the purchase until I actually sat down to read the manual. At that point I found out that my camera had an extra menu screen that the FZ1 should not have. After looking on the Internet I found out that there is a firmware upgrade that can be done to the FZ1 to make it an FZ2. The difference is the FZ2 give you the option of selecting [P A S]. At first I said wow I got a bonus but now im not so sure. It does not seem to focus properly, it does not seem to be giving me a 12x Zoom [basing this on the fact I had an Olympus 720UZ 10X and it seemed to zoom in closer] and im very concerned about the warranty. It hit me the other day that my wife was sold an open box camera, or a demo, or a return. I called the store and the manager said "Don̢۪t worry about it, your warranty will be fine". I have had the camera for three months and I don't like the idea of being sold a camera that looks to me like someone purchased it, done the upgrade, didn't like it and returned it. I am not happy about this and what do you think I should do?
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09/28/2004 07:15:03 PM · #2 |
BTW this is a 12X [420mm] Zoom with this camera. Seems small to me. Edited in photoshop 7 and set to 640X
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09/28/2004 07:30:33 PM · #3 |
| Anyone care to give advice? I need help on this. |
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09/28/2004 07:38:32 PM · #4 |
| Have you tried contacting the manufacturer and notifying them about this situation? |
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09/28/2004 07:40:05 PM · #5 |
| Yes they told me it sounded like someone upgraded the camera. Since I didn't it had to be the store or a customer that had returned the camera. Which was sold to my wife as NEW. |
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09/28/2004 07:42:33 PM · #6 |
I don't think this is legal, if you can prove it was open box. Dell and other computer manufacturers got in a lot of trouble for selling returned computers as new. I don't think the stores are under any different rules.
If I were you, I would demand that the camera is exchanged for a new one or tell them that you will report them.
But I am not a lawyer or judge etc. You can search for cases like this on the web though...
Message edited by author 2004-09-28 23:43:06. |
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09/28/2004 07:51:30 PM · #7 |
| It may be hard at this point to prove it was an open box since it's three months after your wife bought it. Is it fixable with the upgrade firmware? Seems like that would be the simple solution, if you want to keep the cam. |
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09/28/2004 07:58:17 PM · #8 |
| The firmware upgrade is not available in the US only in Asia from what I understand. But it can be downloaded from the Internet because someone posted it. I think that is what happened, someone bought the camera, tried the upgrade and did not like it and returned the camera. The store may have boxed it up and sold it as new. I will not attempt to do a firmware upgrade because I don't know how or what to do and if I did then they would say I did it. I wish there was a way I could see the date the firmware was upgraded in the camera maybe that would be my proof. Is that possible to see when the camera was upgraded? If so I will take the camera back to the store and demand a refund or exchange for a NEW camera. |
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09/28/2004 08:00:47 PM · #9 |
Panasonic should be able to confirm what firmware was shipped with the camera by serial number. Later serial numbers do sometimes ship with newer firmware. But if I understand you right, this is "unauthorized" firmware?
You could also take it to the store and ask them to "downgrade" you back to the original firmware. |
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09/28/2004 08:06:46 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by nshapiro:
Panasonic should be able to confirm what firmware was shipped with the camera by serial number. Later serial numbers do sometimes ship with newer firmware. But if I understand you right, this is "unauthorized" firmware?
You could also take it to the store and ask them to "downgrade" you back to the original firmware. |
YES "unauthorized" upgrade! |
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09/28/2004 08:21:30 PM · #11 |
| was there anything on the receipt saying it was "new"? |
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09/28/2004 08:27:24 PM · #12 |
google search for "selling returned merchandise" and your state, and you might find laws.
See //www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ripoff299.htm for some interesting stories.
You can report them to the BBB.
What "chain"? |
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09/28/2004 08:29:08 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by gorke:
was there anything on the receipt saying it was "new"? |
No. But I was a manager at a nation wide retail store for 10yrs. And we only sold new equipment. But it was not noted on the receipt.
My main concern is warranty, I enjoy having the extra features but working as a retail manager for 10yrs I know how some companies work. The manager will just say anything to get the customer off the phone or out of the store when there is a problem. I wonder if a return is too much to ask for. I'm not made at the store, the manager was nice, and I just want to be covered.
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09/28/2004 08:35:02 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by nshapiro:
What "chain"? |
I sent you a PM with the store name. I don't want to bash a store in a forum. |
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09/28/2004 08:39:08 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by SDW65:
BTW this is a 12X [420mm] Zoom with this camera. Seems small to me.... |
Seems a little small
Here's last nights moon from my Pro1 7xZoom plus x1.7 Teleconverter = about 340mm
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09/28/2004 08:52:33 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by Olyuzi:
It may be hard at this point to prove it was an open box since it's three months after your wife bought it. |
Return it/exchange it for one in a sealed box. Explain to the manager what happened, and that you only just now discovered the firmware hack; that you have verified with the manufacturer that this is not the configuration available for retail sale in your area.
In a situation like this, you/your spouse's sworn testimony will likely be regarded as highly as the store clerk's ... you have an enforceable verbal contract. For them you deliver a product other than as promised is illegal. You generally have one year from the time you discover the fraud to file a report/charges.
The store is likely to replace it with little fuss, especially if you take the approach that it was a mistake and not a scam. Remember, the customer who messed up the camera before returning it probably DID NOT tell the store they'd hacked the firmware ... in all likelihood, as far as the store knew it was a new camera that the customer just didn't like.
If the store manager is mysteriously recalcitrant, then sue them in small claims court and report it to your local District Attorney's Consumer Fraud Division, as well as the BBB. Don't forget to do all this in writing, and be prepared to send copies to the company's national headquarters as well (a CC: and the name of the company president might look good).
If it turns messy, a good resource for legal self-help is Nolo Press. |
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09/28/2004 09:03:53 PM · #17 |
| Thanks to everyone for offering there advice. |
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09/29/2004 02:00:24 AM · #18 |
The firmware upgrade for the FZ1 is hardly a hack, you have to pay for it. It's not like the hacks for the Rebel, this is made by Panasonic, and totally aproved.
On my 12x zoom (Panasonic FZ10), I don't get an enormous moon when zoomed all the way... yours looks about right. I'm suspecting that there's nothing wrong with the camera, and you in fact got a coveted free firmware upgrade to boot! |
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09/29/2004 02:06:08 AM · #19 |
Probably a silly question, but 12x optical zoom?
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09/29/2004 03:25:30 AM · #20 |
That camera does not come in a sealed box. Many cameras don't come sealed. Sony is the major exception. Three months down the road is always a bit tricky for returns. PM me off list and I may be able to help you with some suggestions.
Clara |
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09/29/2004 03:28:26 AM · #21 |
I'd just want to say, when I got my 300D, the firmware update had been issued, so the store's service departement upgrade all the bodies they had in stock...so it was less confusing for the buyer....this in no way voided any waranty since this is a legal upgrade and since the camera was sold as new.
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09/29/2004 03:30:53 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by jadin:
Probably a silly question, but 12x optical zoom? |
Probably a silly answer, but yes! |
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