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02/01/2013 02:50:37 PM · #1001 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
From the source article about the guy gunned down for a wrong turn:
"Puglise said the Sailors family is grief-stricken and is lifting the family of Diaz up in prayer."
Isn't that nice? Perhaps a prayer for guidance BEFORE shooting was in order. Just a thought. |
Right, good to see the focus shifting back a little here... The four guys in the car were LEAVING, backing down the driveway, when Sailor opened fire. It's just, plain terrifying, especially for a deaf person like me. I actually am starting to feel LUCKY that I've never been gunned down for something I didn't even know was happening, and that's ludicrous :-( |
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02/01/2013 03:07:52 PM · #1002 |
| I agree, this is why we need stricter gun laws, because for every person who is trained and a able to handle a firearm, we have 5 or 10 of folks like this. |
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02/01/2013 03:22:55 PM · #1003 |
| And a question: how does "thou shalt not kill" fit into this scenario? He was, by his pastor's account, a devout Christian. |
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02/01/2013 11:28:37 PM · #1004 |
| I don't think this man set out to kill, but something in our culture has scared him so badly that he saw some people pulling into his driveway as a kill or be killed situation, and he had the tools to turn a moment of panic into a tragedy. |
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02/02/2013 04:50:03 AM · #1005 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
I don't think this man set out to kill, but something in our culture has scared him so badly that he saw some people pulling into his driveway as a kill or be killed situation, and he had the tools to turn a moment of panic into a tragedy. |
It must be a cultural thing... unless there is some other unknown reason.
Considering the sheer number of registered gun in the country,one would assume that the USA is the safest country in the world, but sadly that does not seem to be the case.
Ray |
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02/02/2013 05:52:34 AM · #1006 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
I don't think this man set out to kill, but something in our culture has scared him so badly that he saw some people pulling into his driveway as a kill or be killed situation, and he had the tools to turn a moment of panic into a tragedy. |
the media.
people are freaking out. they see and hear about these random events happening all the time. the world has become so small, you see a headline and a story that goes viral and all the sudden you fear it can happen to you.
My mom is convinced that the world is more dangerous now than it was when i grew up, she fears for her grand kids safety at school, yet she forgets that when i was in elementary school, we had a girl stabbed 100 times right before school by her neighbor (the assailant's sister was in my class) we had a shooting on school grounds during let out when a kid found a gun and shot his friend on accident, we had race riots in high school. meanwhile the town i live in hasn't had a violent incident in, well i don't even know of one...
i brought that to her attention and she doesn't even remember those things, that's because she only heard about it on the 6 o'clock news and the next day in the paper, and then more pressing news came along and it got forgotten. not like now where the media has to fill 24hrs of information and crazy stories generate page views and ratings.
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02/02/2013 08:31:33 AM · #1007 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
I don't think this man set out to kill, but something in our culture has scared him so badly that he saw some people pulling into his driveway as a kill or be killed situation, and he had the tools to turn a moment of panic into a tragedy. |
the media.
people are freaking out. they see and hear about these random events happening all the time. the world has become so small, you see a headline and a story that goes viral and all the sudden you fear it can happen to you.
My mom is convinced that the world is more dangerous now than it was when i grew up, she fears for her grand kids safety at school, yet she forgets that when i was in elementary school, we had a girl stabbed 100 times right before school by her neighbor (the assailant's sister was in my class) we had a shooting on school grounds during let out when a kid found a gun and shot his friend on accident, we had race riots in high school. meanwhile the town i live in hasn't had a violent incident in, well i don't even know of one...
i brought that to her attention and she doesn't even remember those things, that's because she only heard about it on the 6 o'clock news and the next day in the paper, and then more pressing news came along and it got forgotten. not like now where the media has to fill 24hrs of information and crazy stories generate page views and ratings. |
Does she not remember the red scare, American concentration camps, civil right unrest, presidential assassinations, cold war, Cuban missile crisis, fallout shelters, etc, etc. Hell, today is utopia compared to the past. |
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02/02/2013 11:17:50 AM · #1008 |
Originally posted by yanko:
Does she not remember the red scare, American concentration camps, civil right unrest, presidential assassinations, cold war, Cuban missile crisis, fallout shelters, etc, etc. Hell, today is utopia compared to the past. |
I remember only too well,do any of you old(er) folks remember the instructions:
- remove glasses (if required),
- removed pens, pencils and any other sharp objects from your pockets,
- loosen your belt (if required),
- place hands behind your head,
- bend over pulling slightly forwards,
- place head between your knees, and
- KISS YOUR ASS GOODBYE. :O)
Ray
Message edited by author 2013-02-02 16:32:54. |
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02/03/2013 07:32:24 PM · #1009 |
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02/03/2013 07:38:15 PM · #1010 |
Yeah, I saw a couple stories on that. It's somewhere between horrible and ironic... |
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02/04/2013 04:10:48 AM · #1011 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Yeah, I saw a couple stories on that. It's somewhere between horrible and ironic... |
lesson? Guns aren't therapy devices for the mentally ill.
Really though, it's pretty obvious that the whole issue revolves around mentally unstable people who somehow aquire guns. Every one of these incidents has shared those two things.
I suppose it really is obvious why the guns are the primary target- no matter how effective or ineffective further regulation would be, commodities are much easier to regulate than people. |
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02/07/2013 09:14:21 AM · #1012 |
Wow.
Maybe we should really consider a full gun ban, but I'm only OK with it if the cops are subject to it as well..
Can you believe that they've shot 2 civilian vehicles in the search for a cop killer? Injured two civilians as well, for what? Driving a blue truck.
Of course, it's even more 'awesome' that the cop killer is an ex-cop. But, you should read his manifesto. Don't believe his claims? I think they seem reasonable enough.
I'm not even sure where I stand on the gun thing, but I know I don't want the good law abiding people who have a conscious to be the only ones without guns, that much is pretty much a given. Listen to this fellow, he seems to have a pretty solid grasp of the thing.
ETA: Just heard that the cop killer has killed the daughter of an ex-cop and her fiancee. Sounds like dude has all-out declared war on the LAPD.
I just can't really fathom how we would ever stop this sort of thing. Seems like fantasy to say we can prevent it, but responding to it really sucks too, as it ends up with cops shooting people because they're too jumped up. What the heck do we do? I don't think taking away some guns, from some people, will work. Maybe all the guns, from all the people. But hell, how realistic is that? It's Pandora's box, as was previously said.
Message edited by author 2013-02-07 14:49:15. |
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02/19/2013 07:32:25 PM · #1013 |
Speaking of preventing things... Get this, the latest on the Sandy Hook shooter is that apparently he chose the target "because it was the "easiest target" and had the "largest cluster of people.""..
So, where does this leave our debate? He really did choose the location specifically because they were unarmed, and because it was a densely populated zone, full of people who clearly wouldn't do well trying to protect themselves.
Horrifying. Honestly just horrifying.
And then, there's the whole Pistorius thing. Did he really kill her on accident? Can you be that thick? Of course, I'm pretty sure that no gun law will ever solve that sort of idiocy, short of outright bans anyway...
Message edited by author 2013-02-20 00:47:42. |
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02/20/2013 01:08:12 AM · #1014 |
Originally posted by Cory:
And then, there's the whole Pistorius thing. Did he really kill her on accident? Can you be that thick? Of course, I'm pretty sure that no gun law will ever solve that sort of idiocy, short of outright bans anyway... |
One things for sure, the trial will be one hell of a media circus if the bail hearing is anything to go by. It sounds like OJ all over again. |
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02/20/2013 04:46:59 AM · #1015 |
Originally posted by Cory:
And then, there's the whole Pistorius thing. Did he really kill her on accident? Can you be that thick? Of course, I'm pretty sure that no gun law will ever solve that sort of idiocy, short of outright bans anyway... |
Considering that some people have shot their own children, husbands, wives etc; thinking they were an intruder, I am inclined to listen to the evidence presented and then, only then, render a decision relative to guilt.
... and no I am not dense. I prefer to get all the facts prior to passing judgement.
I am confident that the learned judge will be able to make a distinction between truth and fiction and render the appropriate decision.
Ray
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02/20/2013 09:05:36 AM · #1016 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by Cory:
And then, there's the whole Pistorius thing. Did he really kill her on accident? Can you be that thick? Of course, I'm pretty sure that no gun law will ever solve that sort of idiocy, short of outright bans anyway... |
Considering that some people have shot their own children, husbands, wives etc; thinking they were an intruder, I am inclined to listen to the evidence presented and then, only then, render a decision relative to guilt.
... and no I am not dense. I prefer to get all the facts prior to passing judgement.
I am confident that the learned judge will be able to make a distinction between truth and fiction and render the appropriate decision.
Ray |
LOL, the "Can you be that thick?" wasn't directed at you, but rather the idiot who shot his girlfriend through a bathroom door. I don't care if it was an accident, that's murder. |
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02/20/2013 09:11:22 AM · #1017 |
| I love Biden's common sense advice to "buy a shotgun" instead of an AR-15 for home defense. Much less lethal. Much more scary. Much easier to use. |
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02/20/2013 09:12:23 AM · #1018 |
Originally posted by Cory:
LOL, the "Can you be that thick?" wasn't directed at you, but rather the idiot who shot his girlfriend through a bathroom door. I don't care if it was an accident, that's murder. |
Even if it was a burglar it's murder (according to the prosecution's scenario anyway). |
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02/20/2013 10:51:20 AM · #1019 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I love Biden's common sense advice to "buy a shotgun" instead of an AR-15 for home defense. Much less lethal. Much more scary. Much easier to use. |
Perfect post for the hypocrisy thread!
Yeah, LOL, stick it outside shoot the only 2 rounds in the gun and now you are armed with just a stick...
I am reminded of the immortal words of Charlie Sheen - "Duh, Winning!"
Message edited by author 2013-02-20 15:51:50. |
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02/20/2013 11:06:51 AM · #1020 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I love Biden's common sense advice to "buy a shotgun" instead of an AR-15 for home defense. Much less lethal. Much more scary. Much easier to use. |
Perfect post for the hypocrisy thread!
Yeah, LOL, stick it outside shoot the only 2 rounds in the gun and now you are armed with just a stick...
I am reminded of the immortal words of Charlie Sheen - "Duh, Winning!" |
Ya, the strategy was a little off, but there's quite a bit to knowing you only have to aim in the general direction to hit it. I have a state DEA friend and the topic of guns came up and he was in favor of a shotgun as well.
I just liked the comment because it's so "middle of the ground" (which is where I like to be). |
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02/20/2013 12:51:43 PM · #1021 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Yeah, LOL, stick it outside shoot the only 2 rounds in the gun and now you are armed with just a stick... |
If you are "inside" and you are shooting at someone "outside" I think any reliance on the doctrine of self-defense in the face of an imminent threat will be shot full of holes by a savvy prosecutor. |
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02/20/2013 06:54:01 PM · #1022 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Yeah, LOL, stick it outside shoot the only 2 rounds in the gun and now you are armed with just a stick... |
If you are "inside" and you are shooting at someone "outside" I think any reliance on the doctrine of self-defense in the face of an imminent threat will be shot full of holes by a savvy prosecutor. |
That's how it works here in Colorado. There was even a semi-recent case where this happened - Man faces manslaughter charges after shooting trespasser. ETA: The law requires the intruder be IN your house and you have reason to believe you are under imminent threat.
Also, I'd say there are probably MORE shotguns on the market that hold in excess of two rounds. It's not just your over under and side-by-side these days. There is, however, a 3 round limit I think if you're using one to hunt waterfowl. Other game is under different limits, and home protection is separate to this. You can readily and legally buy shotguns with much larger magazines. Hell, here's a 6+1 Remington at WALMART.
Message edited by author 2013-02-20 23:55:29. |
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02/20/2013 07:38:32 PM · #1023 |
Originally posted by spiritualspatula:
Also, I'd say there are probably MORE shotguns on the market that hold in excess of two rounds. It's not just your over under and side-by-side these days. There is, however, a 3 round limit I think if you're using one to hunt waterfowl. |
You can only have 3 in the gun when hunting waterfowl, but most pumps and autos hold 5 rounds. |
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02/21/2013 03:05:23 AM · #1024 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Yeah, LOL, stick it outside shoot the only 2 rounds in the gun and now you are armed with just a stick... |
Hmmmmmm.... not something I would want to test. I seem to recall way back when I was enforcing the Migratory Birds Convention Act in the 70's, that shotguns held up to five shells.
Your theory could very well leave someone full of holes. :O)
Ray |
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02/21/2013 03:26:49 AM · #1025 |
Now this is what I'm talking about. Texas is not going to go down without a fight.
I do realize that there will prob be some major suits filed by the feds over this...
Message edited by author 2013-02-21 08:27:58.
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